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Post by lemacd on Oct 17, 2017 2:04:55 GMT
    Sorry I am not very smart and can't figure out how to make them smaller so you'll just have to bear with me here... It struck me as I was wading through caps that they kind of do a little dance here. I mean, do you see what I mean? Body language, man... Also, the second cap... finger wiggles. We see Captain vT do this a couple times throughout the film. I'm not as familiar with CP's filmography, especially in the early years, so maybe this is a CP thing or maybe just a very Captain-y thing to do. Discuss. Lastly... what's in her bag? Surely she didn't expect they would give her material to make some clothes. Was there another uglier dress waiting its turn in rotation? Weird thoughts. Salvage this post. |
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Post by INeverExplainAnything on Oct 17, 2017 2:51:38 GMT
It does look like a dance - OR that they are about to fight - en garde! Especially with the way he circles around her.
I'm not very familiar with CP's earlier work either so not sure about the finger wiggles, but I always understood it to be a sign of him being irritated/uncomfortable with a situation and it's an involuntary reflex. After all, she isn't what he expected and that clearly frustrates him.
With her bag, I assumed it wasn't hers but just something else from the poor bin. And I also assumed they used such a large bag to make her look smaller and awkward. If she had a smaller bag, like a handbag or something, it would make her look neater (I dunno).
That's all I got haha
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Post by paula on Oct 17, 2017 7:21:24 GMT
I think I've seen all of Christopher Plummer's movies at some point, but was too busy looking at his gorgeous face (and his gorgeous body in films like "Royal Hunt Of The Sun," "Battle Of Britain," and "Return Of The Pink Panther," just to name a few!) to notice things like the finger wiggle we've discussed on here. He is SOOOOOOOO hot!!!!! Okay, I won't get started! LOL!
As for what's in Maria's bag, I would guess her nightgown and robe, her Bible, and anything else connected to the Catholic church that a nun-in-training would take with her.
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Post by absurdlittlebird on Oct 17, 2017 11:27:58 GMT
I too find it so hard to believe that the dress she was wearing was the only dress she had with her!
I wish I knew more about the customs of the time period. Do you think the abbey would have assumed that the von Trapp's would provide her with suitable attire? Given the short notice of her arrival? Did Sister Berthe expect Maria to wear her habit and she stubbornly refused, so this was the only alternative she had? How could she survive with only one or two nightgowns? What about underwear? I find the whole lack of luggage so confusing! Despite her being from the abbey with no personal possessions.
Despite the bag being large in size it never looked to me like it was filled with too much, she swung it around when she sung far too easily!
Also had never really thought about the little dance, but you're completely right! It does look like that.
And I think the finger flex was definitely an intentional choice by Plummer, to show Georg's irritation. Plummer has said repeatedly he looked for many ways to make the character anything but wooden. So I think even those subtle movements were used to help him in that quest.
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Post by indigoblue on Oct 17, 2017 21:45:02 GMT
Maybe at the Abbey they gave her the only other dress they had spare (from a previous postulant), to take in her bag, but she doesn't feel she can wear it because it is too smart; yes, it is the Blue Dress...(well, at least it explains where it came from..!)
Also, it may explain why she wore the Blue Dress when she returned from the Abbey,and Georg and Elsa were engaged. Perhaps she just thought "Stuff it, I need a smart dress to wear, it's mine and it's the only one I have, so I'M WEARING IT!"
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Post by lemacd on Oct 18, 2017 0:22:04 GMT
Right before Maria goes to talk to RM about why she ran away, we see RM interviewing a new candidate in that dress, so that's where it came from. I am sure she had under garments because even nuns have underwear, and a night dress and presumably a robe (Maria holds it in front of her when discussing play clothes). There may have been one change of dress but she never wore it once she made new ones. It's not a serious question, really.
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Post by gothicbutterfly95 on Oct 18, 2017 0:22:41 GMT
'En garde' - You all make me laugh. They are doing a bit of a circling thing here, though.
I have seen exactly two other Christopher Plummer films (not counting Up) and both of them were made much later than TSOM. In other words, I'm no finger-wiggle expert. But whether it's a Chris thing or he's doing it intentionally, I think it works.
I think that dress is all Maria has in terms of day-clothes. She says as much, and I think we can all agree she's very honest. I always thought it was hers originally, though every version that isn't TSOM points out it's not. Same with the bag. I mention it briefly in one of my fics, but have a planned story about how she got it.
I think the only other things she had would be a couple of nightgowns (because she lets Liesl borrow one), her dressing gown, some underthings (I'm not even going to try to guess a number on that) and things like a crucifix, rosary and Bible.
And we see her take her slippers off before My Favorite Things, so she has those. But I think at this point, she only has those black boots for footwear.
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Post by INeverExplainAnything on Oct 18, 2017 9:58:56 GMT
In terms of clothes, I'd say it would be the only dress she has apart from the postulant attire (maybe she has two habits?) because at the abbey it would be all she has. And then just two nightgowns and such like gothicbutterfly95 said. Only the basics! |
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Post by indigoblue on Oct 19, 2017 23:56:11 GMT
I must say CP is revealing just how many Apple Strudels he has had in the top screencap...
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Post by utility_singer on Oct 22, 2017 2:46:23 GMT
Strudel and schnapps, lol.
It isn't necessarily a "Chris" thing, as I've not seen him wiggle is fingers in interviews or other 'being himself' situations; but he has used it in other films. Nothing like the number of times we see him using it here, however. So I'll go with definitely a choice as an actor.
In the bag? What everyone said above---a few nightgowns, slippers, another ill-fitting dress, religious items. Perhaps some toiletry items, too.
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Post by augiesannie on Oct 22, 2017 21:17:59 GMT
There are some religious items on her desk in that first bedroom scene, so yes, (And as I've observed before, that enormous crucifix that she NEVER WEARS AGAIN after that first dinner.) I've always wondered how she got ahold of her sensible-but-better-than-black-boots flats that she wears after her first day. Surely she didn't sew them! I always thought she made the blue dress, although we don't see that material in the pile Frau Schmidt gives her (we do see the other fabrics). Undoubtedly she had her iPad and chargers in there too, right? But I digress. lemacd actually that thing about it being a dance is actually quite brilliant. One might write a series of small vignettes where M&G "dance" around each other before they, you know, actually dance. |
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Post by indigoblue on Oct 22, 2017 22:37:35 GMT
Would The Argument classify as a 'dance'?
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Post by augiesannie on Oct 22, 2017 22:59:05 GMT
Would The Argument classify as a 'dance'? that's the spirit! And how about the (earlier) confrontation in the bedroom? And how about that moment after the puppet show? indigoblue you have put me in in the mood! |
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Post by indigoblue on Oct 22, 2017 23:03:28 GMT
...pre- and post-Edelweiss?!
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Post by lemacd on Oct 23, 2017 0:41:39 GMT
right before the gazebo... kind of. I mean, he asks permission, they face each other. When she moves, he moves. I see a lot of potential, augiesannie!! |
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Post by INeverExplainAnything on Oct 23, 2017 4:47:04 GMT
I think they are just ALWAYS dancing.
Vertical expression of a horizontal desire. Oops, back in the gutter I go.
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Post by indigoblue on Nov 20, 2017 0:28:14 GMT
Returning to a less guttersome subject, Do you think Frau Schmidt had got a handle on the revolving-door-situation of the governesses and kept a little supply of essential clothing/shoe items she could recycle with each one? Although they may not have all been nuns, I imagine they may have needed a little help when required to look a bit smart. Perhaps SHE supplied the blue dress?!
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Post by tsomlyss on Nov 25, 2017 20:20:28 GMT
I like the idea of there being a sort of "lost and found" of things that the other governesses left behind when fleeing the villa Von Trapp. Random assortments of shoes and simple dresses.
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Post by indigoblue on Nov 26, 2017 23:23:04 GMT
I'd love to have the opportunity to chat with Frau Schmidt for a bit about goings-on in the house, rather like Maria did on her first night, but a little more...
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Post by gothicbutterfly95 on Nov 27, 2017 2:22:25 GMT
Yeah...
She had a slightly bigger role in the stage version. I don't know it it was really necessary to the film, (given the way it differs from the musical) but it would be nice.
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Post by Anonymous on Jan 28, 2020 0:17:54 GMT
right before the gazebo... kind of. I mean, he asks permission, they face each other. When she moves, he moves. I see a lot of potential, augiesannie !! Just thought about this. I wonder what the significance of him facing her when he says "in love with someone else" and just if there is any meaning behind when they are facing each other and when they aren't. Thoughts? |
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Post by reverendcaptain on Jan 28, 2020 15:56:48 GMT
I would say absolutely there is significance in when they are facing each other in the gazebo scene. The first part they barely make eye contact, and if they do, one of them looks quickly away. They don't know where they stand with each other, and are nervous that their individual feelings are not shared. When he says, "in love with someone else", it is very direct. They are not feeling each other out any more. He is all but telling her he is in love with her, and she feels the same way, so now they are confident to face each other and look eye to eye. I'm not sure how this thread went from the prelude to the gazebo, but maybe all paths leads to the gazebo?  |
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Post by indigoblue on Jan 29, 2020 21:55:40 GMT
I think he feels the time has come to declare himself, or else they will be forever pussyfooting around, avoiding eye contact and being indirect.
So he decides to come out with it and say what he really feels (ie, he is in love with someone), and he lets her know it is her by looking at her directly.
All paths lead to the gazebo - it has been proven...
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Post by utility_singer on Jan 31, 2020 12:08:15 GMT
Well, really, it is all roads lead to sexy time, but a stop at the gazebo is mandatory.
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Post by emilia78 on Apr 16, 2020 18:21:40 GMT
It struck me as I was wading through caps that they kind of do a little dance here. I mean, do you see what I mean? Body language, man... Also, the second cap... finger wiggles. We see Captain vT do this a couple times throughout the film. I'm not as familiar with CP's filmography, especially in the early years, so maybe this is a CP thing or maybe just a very Captain-y thing to do. Discuss. Lastly... what's in her bag? Surely she didn't expect they would give her material to make some clothes. Was there another uglier dress waiting its turn in rotation? Weird thoughts. Salvage this post. It is more like a thorough examination of her I would say,not a dance. He examines her in detail, and maybe tries to intimidate her with his authoritative tone. The finger-wiggle, I would say, is related to the Captain, maybe a characteristic of him, something that CP and the director or the screewriter found interesting to include it in the scene. Maybe a sign of his nervousness? because after the reconciliation and connection with his children, we no longer see his hand wiggling like that. |
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Post by indigoblue on Apr 17, 2020 22:01:38 GMT
Walking slowly round someone is a very intimidating thing to do, as it makes them feel hemmed in.
I saw a clip of CP in recent film (where he is a king), and he did exactly the same finger wiggle as he does in a scene from TSOM; unfortunately I couldn't get the gifs to post, but I concluded that they are from CP's 'gesture bank'- and very effective!
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Post by utility_singer on Apr 21, 2020 11:15:08 GMT
I don't think she meant an actual dance in the 'steps set to music' way; but the 'a successive group of rhythmical steps or bodily motions' way. Also, the courtship or mating rituals of animals are called 'dances'.
While it can intimidating, I think here Wise uses it more as a bit of foreshadowing for the coming scene during the Laendler; when HE stands in place observing her while she circles him.
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Post by NatureCalleth on Apr 24, 2020 5:57:34 GMT
Sorry I am not very smart and can't figure out how to make them smaller so you'll just have to bear with me here... It struck me as I was wading through caps that they kind of do a little dance here. I mean, do you see what I mean? Body language, man... Also, the second cap... finger wiggles. We see Captain vT do this a couple times throughout the film. I'm not as familiar with CP's filmography, especially in the early years, so maybe this is a CP thing or maybe just a very Captain-y thing to do. Discuss. Lastly... what's in her bag? Surely she didn't expect they would give her material to make some clothes. Was there another uglier dress waiting its turn in rotation? Weird thoughts. Salvage this post. Bruh, that first photo really shows all that weight he gained before and during filming L M A O. THICC CAPTAIN |
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Post by NatureCalleth on Apr 24, 2020 5:59:21 GMT
Walking slowly round someone is a very intimidating thing to do, as it makes them feel hemmed in. I saw a clip of CP in recent film (where he is a king), and he did exactly the same finger wiggle as he does in a scene from TSOM; unfortunately I couldn't get the gifs to post, but I concluded that they are from CP's 'gesture bank'- and very effective! Are you talking about 'The Exception'? He plays Kaiser Wilhelm II in that movie. Do you remember approximately when it happened? I could probably find it. |
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Post by indigoblue on Apr 24, 2020 23:33:27 GMT
Yes, that's the film, but I don't know which bit the gif was from.
In fact it was more of a beckoning gesture to someone, which exactly matches how he beckoned to Liesl to leave the room when he got his telegram to join the navy again, against his wishes.
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