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Post by augiesannie on Mar 3, 2014 16:05:33 GMT
let's talk a bit about what G meant by this. it seems like they spent a lot of time in vienna partying. but somehow, she made life more pleasant for him. stories sometimes have them enjoying music? or was she mostly distracting him?
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Post by lemacd on Mar 3, 2014 16:26:59 GMT
distracting. i think he genuinely liked being with her. she was witty and not to bad to look at. they had much in common. i think that if were to be honest, i would hang w/ elsa at a party; she was snark master extraordinaire. we could make fun of people's clothes together. but i digress... he took her mind off his pain and offered a possible alternative to loneliness.
but is that "meaning"? not really. i don't think he remembers what the meaning of life is at that point. he's still raw and wounded, poor man. maybe that is why i kinda feel bad for elsa so much. she did so much of the heavy lifting so maria could truly give him meaning in his life. all she got out of it was a party and free puppet show.
oh, well. she'll be ok. so many rich widowed fish in the sea. oh, wait... maybe not. bummer.
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Post by utility_singer on Mar 3, 2014 18:13:15 GMT
distracting. i think he genuinely liked being with her. she was witty and not to bad to look at. they had much in common. i think that if were to be honest, i would hang w/ elsa at a party; she was snark master extraordinaire. we could make fun of people's clothes together. but i digress... he took her mind off his pain and offered a possible alternative to loneliness. but is that "meaning"? not really. i don't think he remembers what the meaning of life is at that point. he's still raw and wounded, poor man. maybe that is why i kinda feel bad for elsa so much. she did so much of the heavy lifting so maria could truly give him meaning in his life. all she got out of it was a party and free puppet show. oh, well. she'll be ok. so many rich widowed fish in the sea. oh, wait... maybe not. bummer. Word. I agree he doesn't seem to remember what the meaning of life is to that point; and they touch on it within that conversation. "Activity suggests a life filled with purpose", "running away from memories?", "searching for a reason to stay". Elsa's his rebound girl, after the ultimate heartbreak. She was never going to be the next Mrs. Captain Baron von Trapp.
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Post by augiesannie on Mar 3, 2014 19:05:37 GMT
LOVE it. (I still don't get "searching for a reason to stay" but we've beaten that horse to death. With a RC no doubt).
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Post by mireille on Mar 3, 2014 20:48:47 GMT
Maybe "meaning" in the way she brought 'life' back to him. He had distanced himself from his children and the life he led with Agathe. He must have had some meaning in that. When his wife died he lost the music, playing around, going to dinner parties., etc. I'm sure he had some fun activities while Agathe lived and now he misses them. He just can't face to do these things with his children because they remind him of his 'old' life.
Then there's Elsa who showed him there is still a world out there that is very much alive. And gives new 'meaning'
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Post by Deleted on Mar 3, 2014 22:22:25 GMT
I think this conversation between Elsa and Georg is the reason why I don't hate her that much (and why I'm a member of the Baroness Fan Club!) I think I always felt a bit sorry for her that she was the one who "brought some meaning back to his life" and then he fell in love with Maria (I mean obviously she was a bit of a cow in the meantime, but I still do feel sorry for her, and like lemacd, hope that she found happiness somewhere else later on). So just for interest sake, I'm thinking timeline. So Agathe died "several" years ago (say 3?), do you think Georg moped for 2 years, then courted Elsa for 1 year? It would have to be at least 1 year since one of his visits to Vienna he stayed for a month - he probably would have known her for a bit before staying for a month. So what happened during those previous 2 years? Drinking? anything else? Ideas?
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Post by indigoblue on Mar 3, 2014 23:00:36 GMT
I think it would be useful to know when he stopped being a naval commander (apparently Austria lost its only seabord in the first WW, so overnight he would have lost his livelihood). This doesn't tally well with our film, but I always imagine that, if it were in the 1930s, losing the Navy and his wife would make him fall into a dark depression, losing interest in everything including his children and going nowhere.
So you can see how meeting Elsa, and feeling that spark of excitement and fun again 'brought some meaning back to his life', as well as joining in with the ready-made social life that a woman like Elsa would have offered him (hence the trips to Vienna). In terms of how long he has known her - not longer than a year, I think, because they don't really know each other all that well! Yet it might be a time when they would be thinking about marriage.
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Post by augiesannie on Mar 4, 2014 0:02:27 GMT
Some stories have them having been somewhat acquianted years before, that might give them a leg up, so to speak. Also - it's probably obvious to everyone - I always assumed that part of the appeal is that he could forget things in Vienna, it was harder to be home and faced with the memories. I was always a fan of the idea that he may have recovered enough to experience physical desire leading to an empty encounter or two that made him feel even worse about what he'd lost. Not everyone likes that approach, but I do. Agree that the loss of his livelihood is part of the whole gestalt, and let's not worry about the timeline.
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Post by lemacd on Mar 4, 2014 0:34:25 GMT
I always liked stories that had her know agatha too. It kind of adds to the presumption that they should marry because they have so much in common. She could remind him of agatha maybe.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2014 1:11:20 GMT
so if he has lost his livelihood.... what does he do? Obviously he is quite wealthy and I know I've been pretty vague in my stories about his work - he is just in his study doing "stuff" documents and other pretty general things. Ideas of what he actually does?
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Post by utility_singer on Mar 4, 2014 1:34:49 GMT
IRL he inherited Agathe's vast wealth. Some stories have him doing contract/consulting work for the British Navy, engineering work, stuff like that. Independent, so that he is free to go off to Vienna for weeks as a time. No 9 to 5 desk job for our man.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2014 20:31:14 GMT
Re: how Elsa and Georg met....I've read that the real life "Elsa" was an Austrian noblewoman named Princess Yvonne who, apparently, was a cousin of Agathe's. That could certainly mix things up a bit in our SOM world!
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Post by mireille on Mar 4, 2014 20:49:21 GMT
And what are Georg& max?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2014 20:58:21 GMT
Well Georg is totally hot and sexy and Max is a charming sponge.
Oh wait, that's not what you meant....
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2014 20:59:58 GMT
"Max" is based upon Father Franz Wasner, a missionary, who was conductor and director of the Trapp Family Singers. He and Georg were close friends. I suppose Max and Georg are, too though I've read some fics where they are cousins.
although, I like charleybec's answer better.
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Post by indigoblue on Mar 4, 2014 21:44:18 GMT
Many large houses like the von Trapp's had land around them which brought in an income from farmland and forestry. Difficult to know if this was the case in TSOM, but if so, then Georg would most likely have spent a large part of his day running his estate, seeing workmen, checking the plantations, ensuring the crops were healthy and stored well. He would probably have had a manager (from when he was in the Navy) who could oversee things when he was away in Vienna.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2014 22:13:47 GMT
and going out riding with the riding crop.....
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Post by lemacd on Mar 4, 2014 22:16:15 GMT
not to self-promote, but i got the idea of Georg going to Italy to help start a shipping company from this: Vega-Reederie
I think, though, his attempts at business and any kind of work was meant to be a distraction from his sorrow. thus the impression that he stayed away from the children. i think a lot of his trips were for sport, hunting, etc.
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Post by utility_singer on Mar 4, 2014 22:20:53 GMT
that is cool. how did you find that?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2014 22:22:07 GMT
oh, go ahead and self promote... lemacd!! lol! (yeah did you see the story about when Georg was doing push-ups....? lol!) That's a great idea that you had about his business stuff.
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Post by lemacd on Mar 4, 2014 22:22:29 GMT
google. i got 'vega shipping company' from the book.
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Post by indigoblue on Mar 11, 2014 0:11:24 GMT
Another supersleuth!
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Post by emilia78 on Apr 14, 2020 8:34:30 GMT
I think it would be useful to know when he stopped being a naval commander (apparently Austria lost its only seabord in the first WW, so overnight he would have lost his livelihood). This doesn't tally well with our film, but I always imagine that, if it were in the 1930s, losing the Navy and his wife would make him fall into a dark depression, losing interest in everything including his children and going nowhere. The timeline is totally different in the real story than in the film. I prefer to roam into the imaginary story and not in the real one. In our film I guess that his wife died when little Gretl was born, that is 5 years ago let's say. I prefer to imagine that until then or maybe 1-2 years after he continued working because we see him totally absorbed by giving orders to his children that present themselves by marching. He distanced himself from his children, obviously felt emotional numbness and this numbness is what he tried to cover by going to Vienna and partying with the Baroness. She made him feel relaxed and have a good time I think. They had common circles and friends, they went to receptions together, travelling, vacations etc. But he still remained a riddle as the baroness said. He had not found yet peace...
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Post by reverendcaptain on Aug 20, 2020 16:17:27 GMT
The look Elsa gives Georg after he says this! I wish I could find a good screencap. It's vulnerable, and touched, and delighted all in one. Eleanor Parker is a master at subtle facial changes that just make the scene. It makes me feel so bad for her. I know we've talked about it in other threads, but I don't think she's ever been in a relationship for love. Then to have this handsome perfect match of a man tell her she is the reason he has meaning in her life - I would melt too! It sucks so much for her that she wasn't actually what brought meaning back for him. She was just a nice distraction. I hope she wasn't too scarred.
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Post by augiesannie on Sept 11, 2020 23:04:06 GMT
The look Elsa gives Georg after he says this! I wish I could find a good screencap. It's vulnerable, and touched, and delighted all in one. Eleanor Parker is a master at subtle facial changes that just make the scene. It makes me feel so bad for her. I know we've talked about it in other threads, but I don't think she's ever been in a relationship for love. Then to have this handsome perfect match of a man tell her she is the reason he has meaning in her life - I would melt too! It sucks so much for her that she wasn't actually what brought meaning back for him. She was just a nice distraction. I hope she wasn't too scarred. I felt that way too, and I finally had to write a story that ended with her getting herself a nice hunky boyfriend. Then I felt much better.
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