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Post by augiesannie on Aug 28, 2013 1:28:40 GMT
well, he's a complicated guy, so we can let him have complicated motives. do I recall from the book that a, um, liaison with one's governess would not have been unusual? the neighbors were speculating that he broke his previous engagement because he had gotten her pregnant and was doing the honorable thing. it's very romantic when he says that he has to go away so that people won't talk, and how he looks forward to when they can be together permanently. I actually borrowed this idea a couple of stories ago, having him tell her that they had to wait to get married so that, if a baby came right away, no one would think it was conceived before the wedding. I'm not sure everyone married for love back then anyway, further complicating things.
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Post by indigoblue on Aug 28, 2013 23:57:24 GMT
Great, Lemacd and that is what is so nice: we can all argue till the cows come home about what it all means, because it's not absolutely clear - aren't we lucky?!
Anne, the trouble with a new title is that there is an awful lot of meandering going on! How about 'Please don't ask me/Georg and Maria' ?
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Post by augiesannie on Aug 29, 2013 0:11:30 GMT
Or, "Please don't ask me: what happens when Maria returns? Or, "Please don't ask me: M&G upon her return"
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Post by lemacd on Aug 29, 2013 1:04:39 GMT
how about "please don't ask me why it always comes back to the balcony scene"??
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Post by augiesannie on Aug 29, 2013 1:21:47 GMT
I love it, except half the thread is about the scene between the three of them on the steps, and half of it is Georg on the balcony. Can you just imagine the group of us on one of those Salzburg tours? We'd never make it off the steps.
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Post by lemacd on Aug 29, 2013 1:25:32 GMT
we'd be a tour guide's worst nightmare. hahahaha.
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Post by indigoblue on Aug 31, 2013 23:18:47 GMT
How about 'Please Don't Ask Me what this thread is all about'?
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Post by lemacd on Aug 31, 2013 23:39:06 GMT
we have a winner.
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Post by augiesannie on Aug 31, 2013 23:46:12 GMT
Yes, indigo, that's definitely a winner. Except it turns out I can't do it after all. I'm really sorry. You can swat me on the behind with a book if you want. I can change the titles of everything above a thread, but not a thread title.
It turns out, upon further research, that I can move posts to a different thread. So we could just leave the posts about the scene on the steps here, and move the other ones somewhere else.
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Post by indigoblue on Sept 1, 2013 23:03:33 GMT
That would be fine by me, but experience tells me that threads continue to wander this way and that, so there may well be a need to move things again in the future if one were keen to keep it all in order. But it is frustrating to be unable to find a favourite juicy bit, and moving things would help!
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Post by lemacd on Sept 2, 2013 1:15:50 GMT
if it would help others, i say go for it. what a wise and fearless leader...
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Post by augiesannie on Sept 2, 2013 1:42:15 GMT
actually, anyone who is a global moderator can do it, ahem, lemacd. or, to put it differently, all global moderators are wise and fearless, which means we should make indigo one too. But I will try to get to it in the next few days.
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Post by indigoblue on Sept 2, 2013 22:45:17 GMT
Much as I would love to be a Global Moderator (why, it sounds so grand!), severe constraints on my time mean I wouldn't get anything done, so my suggestion is that you pass on this wonderful opportunity to one who would be more effective, and I will do my bit if I ever get a life back...
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Post by lemacd on Sept 3, 2013 1:55:07 GMT
you don't have to do anything. it just means that you have more power. but power does come with great responsibility. but you don't have to. just wanted you to have the full info.
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Post by indigoblue on Sept 3, 2013 22:56:26 GMT
Thanks, Lemacd; I will bear it in mind -
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Post by lemacd on Dec 16, 2013 16:55:16 GMT
ok... procrastinating. i mean, i put boys on a school bus, emailed a teacher, ran to the store, filled the car with gas, called my doctor, called my pharmacy, did the dishes, paid some bills, finished some online christmas shopping... i'm not avoiding life, just my writing.
watched this scene again. still love it so much. so reread this thread because it is always nice to remember how brilliant we are.
children: Father! Fraulein Maria is back from the Abbey! Maria... stunned, bewildered, wondering how to make herself get swallowed by a huge hole in the ground: Good evening, Captain.
now, this:
Captain ALMOST LAUGHING !!: Good evening.
it is just... what is that all about?! do you know what i'm talking about? maybe he's amused at his children huddled around her all happy. maybe he is still laughing at his little 'i'll have cook cancel your dinner' prank earlier.
thoughts?
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Post by augiesannie on Dec 16, 2013 17:01:34 GMT
OMG so delicious. What you said, and also, I think that his default, when panicking/unsure, might be to assume a superior, slightly amused air, while inwardly thinking, "OMG, WTF," and other acronyms. Because he does sound kind of bewildered in his next line. "You left without saying goodbye,....etc.)
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Post by lemacd on Dec 16, 2013 17:29:11 GMT
yes, yes... and do you think he was trying to maintain in front of the children? i mean, what if she returned and they face each other without the children around? how would that 'good evening' sounded like, i wonder. probably not that different, but... we know she is still reeling from finding out about the engagement. if he heard them tell her (it's possible, right?) and saw that look on her face... could he be thinking "ah. so i wasn't just imagining things." maybe his male ego was pleased to see her reaction to his engagement.
i realize that isn't exactly making him a nice guy, but heck he's human.
ramble off.
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Post by utility_singer on Dec 16, 2013 17:58:34 GMT
Ooh, so much good stuff in here. I will have to gather my thoughts, which are spinning out of control, and put them together in a coherent fashion.
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Post by augiesannie on Dec 16, 2013 19:59:24 GMT
So looking forward to your take. This could be something like the Balcony. I love what lemacd said about how he sees her face and knows it wasn't just his imagination.....
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2013 20:03:10 GMT
Wow, just by coincidence I was watching this scene at about 3 am today (what else do you do when you are up with a baby?) and I wondered for the first time just how long the Captain had been standing there before the children noticed him. I think he must have been there at least a while because when the shot cuts to him he is just there, not walking out, but just already there. So probably he saw her Maria's reaction to when she heard the news about his engagement. It seemed pretty obvious from her reaction to the news how it just rattled her. Compare that with earlier in the movie when Maria was talking with Frau Schmidt about the captain and the baroness and the possibility of their marriage, she was so excited and pleased at the thought "that's wonderful, the children will have a mother again"! Such a massive difference! I guess a few things happened in between those scenes (like a small thing of her falling in love with him! Lol)
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Post by augiesannie on Dec 16, 2013 20:25:58 GMT
That's a great point - he's been watching for a while. There's a moment when she and the children are walking toward the house, and her eyes slide in the direction of the house -- we know she's thinking of him -- so he's not there then, but agree he definitely saw her get the news. Also, you are so right about everything that's changed from her days of "great, I'm going to help them get ready for their new mother." This is a transition I'm trying to write about in the garden story, but I haven't quite gotten to her conversion yet.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2013 20:42:59 GMT
Ooo, I didn't notice the eye flick to the house ... I might have to go and re-watch that part!!
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Post by augiesannie on Dec 16, 2013 22:11:18 GMT
one of my favorite things about this group: people are always pointing out things I've missed. Like tranquillity and the eye flick after the puppet show. Or the sleeves thing in the gazebo. (which now seems so obvious to me, I don't know how I missed it).
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2013 22:37:16 GMT
Actually when I sat down yesterday to watch the movie I had the intent to try and pick up as many details that I had never seen or noticed before (and it was also to cheer me up since I had had a really rotten day). Amazing the stuff you can miss when you aren't looking for it (or the things that you see when you are looking for that extra detail, like I had never noticed the horse running in the paddock when Maria gets off the bus during I have confidence). Gosh I love this movie!
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Post by lemacd on Dec 16, 2013 23:02:00 GMT
oh, no... she said horses. cue the riding crop joke.
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Post by lisab1991 on Dec 16, 2013 23:15:59 GMT
I was thinking the exact same thing!
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Post by utility_singer on Dec 17, 2013 2:28:13 GMT
The first rule of the riding crop is to not joke about the riding crop. here is her look up to the house Yes, he's definitely been watching for a while, and most assuredly saw her reaction to the news of his engagement. Possibly came out as soon as she looked away, as when she receives the news none of the children are positioned to see him---they are completely focused on Maria, and she on them. Screencaps show him standing at the top of the stairs, with an expression I'd describe as guarded. It's all in the eyes, and CP is just so good at that. I won't cap it here because it is too small to see, but it the whole bit is on this page. I think he wants to go to her, but not in front of the children, and not while engaged to Elsa. The last screen cap on that page is his head turning, and the next page begins the whole bit when Elsa comes out and he winds up with that weird grin. Going frame by frame, it looks to me as if he watches Elsa walk toward them, with a flat expression. When she gets to him and takes his hand, he looks at Maria and never takes his eyes off her, almost as if he is willing her to look at him and meet his gaze. It's quite a wistful, longing look in my mind, and that gets the weirdness out of it. Almost like he's wishing the stumbling blocks away, so he could just sweep her into his arms. Then as Maria starts up the stairs, he drops Elsa's hand when he turns to speak to Maria, asking if she's there to stay. Elsa has been watching Maria until he drops her hand, and then she fixes her gaze on Georg. I think at that moment she knows her time is up. His disappointment in Maria's answer is evident on his face, and he gets that same look in his eyes that he has when the children were singing so sadly just a little bit ago. His expression doesn't change much but Elsa looks from him, to the ground, back up at Georg. Her face shows that, even though he's taken her hand and smiled at her, that she knows she has lost him. By the fourth balcony shot, he is looking very melancholy and has begun twitching his fingers, even before Elsa comes out. But he spies Maria in the first one, before he even steps out of the door.
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Post by augiesannie on Dec 17, 2013 3:08:18 GMT
I don't even know where to begin to respond to all this awesomeness, and I have to go to bed, so for tonight I am just going to say that in addition to utility's awesomeness, it shows what an amazing actor he is, to have crafted all of this...Eleanor Parker too, JA for that matter. As you know, I'm not 100% sure that he's all the way ready to marry her when the three of them meet up on the steps, I think his mind is racing and chaotic and is thrilled that she's back to explore things and . . . . but the balcony seals the deal. Whatever. It is all just amazing. Oh, right, I said I was going to bed.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 17, 2013 4:07:45 GMT
Ok, since I'm new here, I don't know the whole backstory of the riding crop but from what I can gather from reading some older posts, it practically has its own fan club!
Anyway I think the Captain is just totally rattled by the end of this scene, no wonder he ends up quiet at dinner later on!
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